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Post by juliab on Oct 29, 2008 18:07:55 GMT -5
I keep hearing about how bad sweetfeed is for horses and it made me wonder if free choice grass hay with oats and beet pulp substituted for sweet feed might be better. Maybe with some alfalfa cubes also to add in some calcium? When I had a horse in Australia (back in the dark ages  ), we fed chaff (chopped hay) and oats and alfalfa hay and my horse seemed to do really well. This would be for adult horses. I'd feed the babies on Triple Crown Growth until they are 2 years old as I've had very good results with that. |
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Post by Big Tee© on Oct 29, 2008 18:37:07 GMT -5
My horses live happily on beet pulp, oats, and good hay. You likely won't need to add alfalfa for mature horses, but for young growing stock, you really should.
Sweet feed, per se, isn't bad for horses but what is generally sold as sweet feed is a gooey mess of garbage grains that are processed beyond recognition and it isn't, well to quote Alton Brown, good eats. Sweet feed used to be whole or lightly rolled oats, crimped barley and corn woth some molasses, but the last bag i bought for bribery purposes was completely flattened oats and barley, crushed corn and some sodden mass held together with molasses - definately not good eats and the recipeint of the bribe was not impressed. Now this was Donnie who will happily eat dry molasses without complaint or fussing but he would not eat this sticky mess. I am certain that some where there is still real sweet feed, but the money now is on processed beyone recognition extruded feeds that at least these two have no interest in. Molasses, in and of itself is also not bad, but a great way of supplemeting copper provided it is given in sensible amounts which is not the gluey mess-in-a-bag that passes for sweet feed - takes a lot of liquid molasses to stick dust to processed grains.
FWIW, most of the race track people around here have reverted to the old way of feeding. mostly oats, adding whole corn, and rolled barley, hand mixed with either Equi-liq or dry molasses and McIntosh's vitamins. The sweet feed was being rejected by the horses, so the old ways resurfaced.
My winter feed: 8-10 pounds beet pulp, split in two feedings, same in oats, a handful of molasses, a touch of salt, and all 'cooked' together with hot tap water to make a lovely warm and sloppy meal. Add to that a good whack of hay, and happy horses even in the coldest weather. I never have horses lose weight over winter, frequently have the opposite problem and really have to watch they don't get too fat. They are not silly either, or at lwast no sillier than normal.
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Post by alisonph on Oct 30, 2008 6:46:48 GMT -5
Julia,
I feed what BT feeds, except I do add a small amount of alfalfa cubes. When I did the ration balancing, 30 lbs grass hay, 6 lbs oats and a small amount of extra protein when they are in work is all they needed to maintain body condition. I also feed free choice minerals.
You should look for an edition of "Morrison's Feed and Feeding". It is a great book that spells out the basic's of feeding farm animals, both in work and not. Basically, it tells how much protein, starch, etc, an animal should be getting.
BT, do you feed 8-10 lbs dry beet pulp or is that with water added?
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Post by Goalie on Oct 30, 2008 7:51:33 GMT -5
I also feed what BT feeds and add some BOSS and a little bit of Purina senior feed instead of alfalfa cubes. My guys are all "seniors" and seem to thrive on this diet. they have their choice of alfalfa hay and a really good grass hay.
Let us know what you decide.
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Post by Big Tee© on Oct 30, 2008 7:58:14 GMT -5
alisonph - always weigh feed of any kind dry - no point weighing water. One thing about beet pulp, unlike oats, or other grains, it is consistant and once you know what 5 pounds looks like in your measure, it is mostly gonna be 5 pounds unless you have a lot of fine stuff in the bottom of a bag and that fine stuff is HEAVY!!! This is the first year I dont have protein % on my hay, but there is a fair amount of alfalfa in most of it, and those native grasses are pretty high in protein anyway
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Post by Katelyn on Oct 30, 2008 8:24:11 GMT -5
Everybody here is on a ration balancer (Progressive Nutrition Grass) and free choice hay. Some get oats, some don't.
Everyone is doing BEAUTIFULLY on it!
I went from feeding my lactating mare, Panda, 18lbs/day of TC Growth to 4lbs ration balancer and 5lbs oats per day.
At weaning time, she was absolutely glowing! When I took her to the boarding barn, they didn't believe me that this was my "newly weaned mommy" b/c she looked so great, until they looked at her bag!!
My new DWB mare, 17.1+h, is GAINING weight (needed from lactating/weaning) on 2.5lbs ration balancer and 4lbs oats!!
My pregnant mare looks great on 3lbs ration balancer/day.
Weanling looks great, no big potbelly, on 4lbs/day.
Jay is my hardest keeper by far and he's doing well on 6lbs alfalfa cubes, 2lbs beet pulp, 2lbs oats, and 4lbs high fat per day.
The alfalfa for him really helps with buffering his stomach.
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Post by JulieM on Oct 30, 2008 13:45:05 GMT -5
I can't even begin to tell you how Brig has blossomed! I changed his feed several times due to suspected ulcers and a weak topline. He's not in much exercise these days, but gets at least ten hours of turn-out each day.
15 - 20 lbs. grass/alfalfa mix hay (60% alfalfa). This is basically free-feed for him, he doesn't go through all of it each day, but will eventually.
4 lbs rice bran daily (split AM and PM) with 4 cups alfalfa pellets (also split) and his supplements which include a joint supplement w/ MSM, vitamins w/ Biotin, Omega Shine (it's cheap, so why not? and my dog gets it as well), per my chiropractor baking soda daily and U-Gard.
No more bony topline, his coat is so slick that bareback is difficult and he's so mellow and happy, not grumpy. I'm going to snap some photos of him tonight for comparison.
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Post by alisonph on Oct 31, 2008 7:43:05 GMT -5
alisonph - always weigh feed of any kind dry - no point weighing water. One thing about beet pulp, unlike oats, or other grains, it is consistant and once you know what 5 pounds looks like in your measure, it is mostly gonna be 5 pounds unless you have a lot of fine stuff in the bottom of a bag and that fine stuff is HEAVY!!! This is the first year I dont have protein % on my hay, but there is a fair amount of alfalfa in most of it, and those native grasses are pretty high in protein anyway I figured you were weighing it dry. I"ve never weighed beet pulp, but 10# seems like a LOT! You must have big feed tubs:) |
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Post by juliab on Oct 31, 2008 8:16:15 GMT -5
The key will be getting the beet pulp. It has become really hard to find around here since August. Alfalfa cubes are easy to get. I recently cut back on their sweet feed (they get Blue Seal Rider) right now and increased their hay for during the night. There is very little left of the hay by morning and much less waste. Right now it is a nice looking timothy. They also have round bales of mixed grass hay for during the day outside. I can't give Indy beet pulp unfortunately, because he and Argo are out together and Indy will eat about half of his and then lose interest and let Argo finish, so I feed him 3 - 4 meals in small amounts and he has done much better on this. The boy has a metabolism like Michael Phelps! He is still all muscle - I don't know how he does it. I might have to keep Indy on sweet feed to keep his weight up. It is not a problem for the other horses as they all go into a stall at night. I could put Indy and Argo into stalls for feeding but it greatly increases my daily chores as it would mean carrying water buckets and working in the dark. Hubby is supposed to put some lights in their little barn soon, so that would definitely make it easier, but it is no fun right now. Right now they get fed in buckets on the fence and I put timothy hay in their stalls so they can eat in there when the weather is bad. They also have a round bale.
I'll have to price out the oats and see if it will be cost effective too.
Thanks for your help.
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Post by Big Tee© on Oct 31, 2008 8:54:37 GMT -5
alisonph - always weigh feed of any kind dry - no point weighing water. One thing about beet pulp, unlike oats, or other grains, it is consistant and once you know what 5 pounds looks like in your measure, it is mostly gonna be 5 pounds unless you have a lot of fine stuff in the bottom of a bag and that fine stuff is HEAVY!!! This is the first year I dont have protein % on my hay, but there is a fair amount of alfalfa in most of it, and those native grasses are pretty high in protein anyway I figured you were weighing it dry. I"ve never weighed beet pulp, but 10# seems like a LOT! You must have big feed tubs:) No, that amount is split into two feeds, they dont get that all at once, but I don't use feed tubs, I feed in pails. |
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Post by Pam on Nov 1, 2008 6:03:49 GMT -5
Julia, if you have Blue Seal feeds, they also make beet pulp pellets. I've found them easier to get here. Ask you dealer if he can order them for you if they don't stock them. I like the pellets a lot, much less storage space necessary. Instead of mixing them 1-1 with water, you use 3 parts water to 1 part pellets. If you use really hot water, they break down very quickly, even quicker than shreds. I put hot water in 2-1, then add the other part in cold water after they fluff up.
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), we fed chaff (chopped hay) and oats and alfalfa hay and my horse seemed to do really well. 
